{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/b853f4nr7q/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Steve Eye"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/038/original/university-libraries-logo-2x.png?1711560609","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Source"]},"value":{"en":["Downtown Performance Center (DPC) Oral History Project, MS 858"]}},{"label":{"en":["Relation"]},"value":{"en":["Downtown Performance Center (DPC) Oral History Project (is part of)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Eye, Steve (Interviewee)","Purdy, Trent (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2026-03-28 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Coverage"]},"value":{"en":["Arizona--Tucson (spatial)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":[".mp3"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["University of Arizona Libraries"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCopyright held by University of Arizona Libraries\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Identifier"]},"value":{"en":["MS858.009 (uid)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Type"]},"value":{"en":["Oral Histories"]}}],"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCopyright held by University of Arizona Libraries\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["University of Arizona Libraries"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["University of Arizona Libraries"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/038/original/university-libraries-logo-2x.png?1711560609","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/public/images/audio-default.png","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - azu_ms858-009_a.mp3"]},"duration":4156.536,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/public/images/audio-default.png","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-arizona.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/309/418/original/azu_ms858-009_a.mp3?1779578333","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":4156.536,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["transcript [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: This is Trent Purdy. It is march 28 2026 I'm sitting here with Steve I in Tucson, Arizona. We're doing an oral history about the debt for the Downtown Performance City Downtown Performance Center Oral History Project to be donated to the University of Arizona Special Collections Library. Thanks for joining me today, Steve. Let's start at the very beginning, if you don't mind, how did you discover and get involved in the underground music thing?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=0.0,25.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Well, it all goes back to Philly, and that's where I grew up, and it all goes back to skateboarding, that's where it all started and so the what happened was started skating in Philly on the street, and we would sit there and look at the magazines, and I started like visualizing that I need to build a ramp to skate on, and I was going to art school at the time, and Philadelphia College of Art, and I was in the sculpture department, and I built a ramp on school grounds, first thing I've ever built in the school there, first ramp in Philly, it was a quarter pipe, and built that for credit, for college art school credit, and and that started the whole idea of the interactivity with what humans need to evolve and, and so from there I started working on this site downtown that kids were, I don't actually remember if they started building ramps, but I got involved in building ramps for these young kids that were really wild from all over the city that didn't have anywhere to go, and skateboarding was the thing that kept them from getting in trouble, and so I started building all these ramps on this site, and then started working with the kids, and and realized that they need more inspiration and support, and that's when I got into becoming elementary school art teacher, and I was going to the art school for sculpture, and then I went to Temple University to become elementary school art teacher, and the plan was how to be subversive in the system and get in with the young kids and elementary level and and trying to inspire them and and that's what I did and started building the ramps, and the ramps, the culture of skateboarding was inspired, the intensity, the power, the go for it attitude was inspired by the music, and the music, at first, was all from England, new wave and punk, and every thing was all about England, and that's our whole focus was England, and then America started getting its own bands, and we had a movement, American hardcore movement, and and we found out about that because I was me and my partner at the time were doing, we were the resident artists at Cherry Hill Skate Park in New Jersey, and we would bring out different pro skater dudes from Cali, and I think it was Brad Bowman was the first guy that told us about the Circle Jerks, and at that time the Stranglers were one of our favorite bands, all these different bands from England, the Buzz Cox, Gang of Four, 999 Susie, and The Banshees, and then we found out about American Hardcore, and then we were like, \"Fuck England, we got our own shit now, and it was so power. Wonderful, and so amazing that we were really psyched about it, and then, and so at that time it was there, was no separation between the bands and the skate scene and the bands were skaters and all the there was probably up to 100 skate parks in the in the country and we were really involved in the one in Cherry Hill and that's where we met Bruce and he was still in the Navy, and he had a car, and we got to get a ride with him back and forth, and so that whole time the skate culture evolved to a point where it was every city in the country, and then all the insurance companies freaked out and raised the rates tenfold, and all the skate parks in the country closed down pretty much, and it went back to a grassroots scenario, where back to the ramps again, and at that time everybody was connected through the music, and and then all the skater dudes got into bands and started making music, and it just became this was our culture, this was our life, this is what we created, and so me being an artist and not thinking that I was any different than any other artist, I went to art school, I was fully immersed in the history of art and the culture of it. I just started calling up these well-known people, Ian Mackay of Minor Thread, or Glenn Danzig, all sorts of different people. There was no booking agents at that time, the industry, the music industry, and the punk rock realm didn't really happen, and and then started bringing these people to Philly, and at that time I was fortunate enough to be able to get a video camera that was like 19, our first shows are 1981 I think, or 1980 1981 and started documenting the shows on video, and it was amazing that that just sort of cemented and planted the seed of what would emerge out of that, and what emerged was we got of our first space was called Love Hall, and in Philly, and that's when it really started happening. Our connection to the music scene, which developed into the music industry, and so Philly got played out for me, and I wanted to move to Cali, but one of my younger brothers was living in Tucson, and I stopped here on my way, on my planned way to go out there, because Cali was like the promised land for skater dudes, and then I got sort of, I spent my money here, I got sort of stuck here, and made the best of it, and saw the scene that they had here in Tucson, and and was interested in it, and I went to different events that were happening and found out that I could get this building and I was fortunate enough to find a way to get that building on 31 East Tool, which I'm still in 38 years later, and we did our first shows there. The whole idea is in doing the show business was based on creating community and. Then the community ideal comes from Philly, and how we're all connected there in this, the way the architecture is designed, everybody is sort of pushed together in this one area in the downtown, and well, there's many areas, but we were in the downtown, and it was, we were really inspired by the way community evolved, and the way everybody worked together, and so it sort of became very close-knit community, the punk scene and the skate scene was very territorial because we were doing something that at that time nobody else was doing, and it became very protective of we saw how rock had go got co-opted by the corporate entities, and yeah, so we were determined not to let our music and our skate scene get co-opted by the corporate realms, and so we were very protective of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=26.0,688.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: it,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=689.0,689.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: and we didn't want people that didn't know you had to know how to get into it, and and so out of that reality, it wasn't so good for a business perspective, and so we were always on the edge business wise, and because we didn't deal with the economics of the music industry, which is it's all based on selling alcohol and I was committed to not doing that and that shaped who we were and what we would become by the fact of never being able to get enough funding to really develop the business into a way that was functional for the people that were involved in it, and so it went on like that, and it's still going on like that, where without a bar everything is is transformed into a different realm, and coming to Tucson transformed me, and from a city perspective into more earth-based culture, and I started communicating with the earth more, and developing my love affair for the Mother Earth, and out of that came inspiration from reading different channel books of Pleiadian culture off the planet kind of ideals and inspiration, and from that created the idea of without judgment we're balancing out destructive energy with beauty and culture, so living in a town where one of the biggest businesses is bomb making Raytheon, without going mentally insane from thinking of, oh my god, they're building nuclear bombs here in our backyard, and we think people say, How's it going? Have a nice day, and yeah, so what do we do about that? We try to find ways to stay focused on thinking that we're at the perfect place at the perfect time for what comes next, without judgment, with full forgiveness, without the understanding that we are not the victims of anyone or anything, that we have unlimited potential and power to change the world in a more harmonious way, and so that. How the DPC, and that's how solar culture became what it is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=690.0,906.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: It's been sort of your overarching philosophy or ethos throughout your entire quote unquote career as a booker","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=907.0,913.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: or journey.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=914.0,913.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Journey,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=914.0,914.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah. I would say,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=915.0,916.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: do you mind if we go into a little more nuts and bolts of some historical things,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=917.0,920.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: if my mind will allow it. Yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=921.0,924.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: I'm curious about how you know you established these skate parks and ingratiated yourself with the local skateboarding community, and you said there were younger kids. How did they feel about you doing this, being older? You're probably like, what, 10 years older than some of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=925.0,939.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: So, in Philly, when I first started, I was in my early 20s, and the kids were like 1213, 1415, and by the time they turned 16 and got a car, then they were gone, and you didn't see them anymore, but they were. that's where I got the inspiration that these young kids need me, so that's why I went to Temple University, so I could have the right to work and with the youth in the school systems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=940.0,976.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Did any of these kids go on to form bands that you're aware of, yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=977.0,984.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah, all sorts of stuff, even though lots of kids went on to become teachers, the same path that I took, but one of them is about to come to town right now, playing with HR at Congress tomorrow night, Zeke, and he, he's about to come into Tucson today, and he's playing with HR of the Bad Brains tomorrow night at Congress.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=985.0,1015.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Yeah, I plan on going to that show.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1016.0,1016.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Oh, nice. Yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1017.0,1017.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: I've never seen his.. I've never seen him before, and it was the Bad Rangers. Yeah, so this is well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1018.0,1022.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: it's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1023.0,1023.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: as a reggae fan, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1024.0,1024.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: It's nowhere near the Bad Ranges, and HR is nowhere near what he was when I first videotaped him in 80.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1025.0,1036.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So, you, you, and if I understand correctly, you and Bruce started doing promotions at Love Hall. Is that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1037.0,1042.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: so? At that time, it was me and Bruce and this other guy, Howard Saunders, and we were called Bunga Boosh. I, Howard Saunders was Bunga, and Bruce was boosh and the eye,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1043.0,1064.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: so did these nicknames have any significance? I know the origins of your nickname with the video recorder.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1065.0,1069.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, I don't know how those guys got their name. I don't remember. Howard's not on the planet anymore, and Bruce can tell you his word,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1070.0,1082.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: so you talked about I'm assuming your policy of all ages and no alcohol that was established with Love Hall, is that correct for the shows, and yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1083.0,1098.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: chiefly don't remember that part back then. If we had alcohol there or not, yeah, I don't remember it. Bruce would probably remember all those little details like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1099.0,1113.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Did you guys model Love Hall in sort of her philosophy behind show promotion on anything else, like any other venues,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1114.0,1120.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: or well, at that time there was, it was the hall that was what it was called, yeah, everybody, that was the, the thing that was happening, it wasn't a club, it was a hall that was our, our stamp on the venue reality, it was, we didn't call it a venue, we, that's what we call them halls, because that's a lot of VFW halls were rented, and places where they would rent to kids before they, who knew what was going to happen at those shows, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1121.0,1165.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So was Love Hall the name you guys came up with?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1166.0,1170.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: It was Love Club before that, and we took it over and changed it to Love Hall, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1171.0,1178.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: you kept the name Love, which is interesting to me, because that hardcore scene I don't necessarily equate it with love, it was a very aggressive,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1179.0,1186.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah, so that was that's what started me on the path, I came from a spiritual perspective. Active and and that happened in my earlier days when I started doing altering with at the time with LSD and and then reading spiritual books from India Eastern philosophy, which really my whole path has been based on a spiritual path, and from the very beginning, so love hall fit with my philosophy and actually the notion that punk rock is the violent destructive force is actually a media myth. The people that were really involved were skater dudes that were super intense, and that's what often gets misunderstood - intensity as something that's evil or scary or darker. It was people that cared. It was, you know, you, a lot of the bands were made with activist orientation. It was people that are like, \"fuck the system and fuck the status quo, and we got to create our own world. So that was a big part of years ago when Fugazi came to town, and I was at sort of fading out of the punk rock scene at that point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1187.0,1308.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: was this the Rialto show in 2001","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1309.0,1310.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, I was. I said to Ian, yeah, I'm not feeling the music anymore, and just not, not in my realm, and he was like, it's not about the music, it's about the DIY culture that always stuck in my head, that yes, instead of putting all this energy into hating the system, and like, fuck this and fuck that, that we use our energy to recreate the culture for what does work, instead of like being angry all the time at what doesn't work, we use our energy to create what does work, and that is the essence of why all the motivation came to do all this stuff, and how I dedicated my life to that path.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1311.0,1374.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: What did the did you ever espouse this? Miss, the sort of like I hate to say the word mystical, but spiritual, positive spiritual philosophy to the punks at Philly that you would encounter at the time, and I'm curious, like, what their reaction was. Yeah, well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1375.0,1392.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: at that time I was like alien, almost, you know, people like, what the fuck, what is he talking about, and then, yeah, they didn't quite understand at that time, but now everybody's talking about it, but, but, and then I came out west, and there was more people that understood what I was talking about, but yeah, and people eventually, I mean, everybody comes to terms with their mortality and their, you know, who we are on this plane, and those, those questions are eternal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1393.0,1440.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: I want to test a little bit about how you started booking bands at Lo Paul. You said you would just call up Ian McKay from from Minor Thread or Glen Dancing from the Missiles. The","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1441.0,1450.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: first thing that happened was calling them","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1451.0,1454.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: from their.. how did you get that contact information?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1455.0,1456.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: That I don't remember, maybe it's on the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1457.0,1459.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: records, I can't even, yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1460.0,1460.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: I don't remember, but and once you do a show and you have well-known acts, it just follows that more find out about it. It was, that was what was so amazing about our scene, was it was a tight-knit scene. We, we were connected to all the other scenes, and so we, we were.. it wasn't long before other people started contacting me, and then.. and then soon. You put yourself out there, and that was before the booking industry, so it was always bad calling, and and then, and then when I came out here to Tucson, that's when the booking industry sort of started for me. I don't remember so much in Philly, but there was still lots of bands calling, and in those days with the DPC days, anyone who would call, I would like help them through town and get a show for them, and get them money, and feed them, and have them a place to sleep at night, and but that got played out with all the local guys playing, and all the money would go to the touring guys that no one knew or cared about, and then so that's when the booking agent thing started where they would send us famous people that people wanted to see, and in those days I just started with a lot of those booking agencies. I mean, it was. I built it up to probably I had 30 different agents contacting me, and and I worked on because we were in a bar and we didn't have guarantee money, I worked on trust with door deals, we did 60 4060 for the bands and 40 for us, and the music industry doesn't operate like that. They operate with guarantees and bars.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1461.0,1612.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: An","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1613.0,1612.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: all-age place with no bar is not a functional economic business model for the music industry, and the normal model is the venue gets the bar and the bands get the door, and we had to split the door with the bands, and there's not enough money to really operate like that functionally. We always did our best to make it work,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1613.0,1650.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: so those booking agents, much as I mean, I'm assuming some of them represented multiple bands, right? It wasn't just.. oh,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1651.0,1655.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah, yeah. The way that works is they, they were always in big cities, and they would, they would start with a roster of different bands, and they would have maybe one or two that were more famous, that would be for the Rialto, and then the other ones were up and coming ones that were like no one hardly knew about, and then so they would push those bands on us, and then they would dangle a big show at the Rialto, you know, do all these little ones, and then you get the big one and make the money, and it wasn't so functional, Angel keeps calling,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1656.0,1711.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: so you did Love Hall from 1981 to, I think, 1983 is that correct?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1712.0,1717.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: I think so, and then for for us I that was the end of the punk scene really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1718.0,1726.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: and so you must","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1727.0,1728.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: have by 83 was played out it was you could actually say punk was dead at that point what that means is that it got co-opted and we lost the, the, the close-knit community that we had. It started, the started getting co-opted by special interests and big business, and now people knew they could make money from it, and, and, yeah, that was the beginning of the end, so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1729.0,1763.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: you're talking major labels in television, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1764.0,1766.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah, they were, it just, it just started, yeah, getting commercialized, and yeah, I stopped, and then two years later I moved to Tucson, and 85 and and I didn't plan on doing shows here, I don't think, but I don't remember why it happened, but I, all I do remember at that time was I was living with these guys. Is that were involved in the Tucson punk scene, and that were involved in the theater scene, and I thought that was amazing, that the punk scene had connections to the theater scene here in Tucson.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1767.0,1815.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: What did you think about how the Philly punk scene compared to the Tucson Punk scene,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1816.0,1821.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: well, big city versus small town,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1822.0,1826.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: it's a totally different world. So, in my conversation with Anita, she, she seemed amazed that you, and then later Bruce moved out here, she compared moving from Philly to Tucson to moving from Los Angeles to like Gila Bend, there's like such a discrepancy. Did you feel that way?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1827.0,1845.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Well, I mean, the, the, the, there's, there's stuff that you could say that, yeah, it would, it could be like that, but the way we were, we were, we were in a small world, even though we were in the big city. The skater dudes, when I was going to Temple University to become an elementary school teacher, I was the only one ever on the subway with a skateboard, I was there, was hardly anyone skating in downtown Philly, and was very everything was super tight knit, and so even though we were in a big city, we were in a little world in the big city, and so when I came to Tucson, it was, it was more spread out than what I was used to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1846.0,1910.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So you encountered punk rockers and skateboarders here in town.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1911.0,1916.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, so it was. I started going to some of the shows here, and saw the scene, and came from a scene, and I was like, you know, I can do this here, I don't know. So, what happened was there was a gestation period of up to two years, that's what I used to say, big city people come to Tucson, and they got about two years before they're ready to move somewhere else, and then, so I was, I had these roommates that were involved in, they were doing this really cool thing with the, with UPS, it was called Sir Shade, crime fighter of the cosmos, and, and UPS was, was doing the music for them, and it was a really cool scene. They were these guys were our roommates, and one of the guys, Pat Kelly, it was John Minx and Pat Kelly, and I was ready to move out of Tucson, and I, I was going to pay a company to find me a job in another country, I was ready to go to another country, and Pat Kelly was like, why pay for an opportunity when you have an opportunity","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=1917.0,2005.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: here,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2006.0,2005.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: and those words stuck in my head, and that's when I went out, and I was like, all right, if I find a warehouse, then I'm going to stay, otherwise I'm leaving, and I went out, and I found the most amazing warehouse, and then I stayed, and all the stories that came after, so we closed down the DPC because of the neighborhood rebelled against","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2006.0,2034.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: us,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2035.0,2035.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: and I tried to calm everybody down, and that didn't work, and I was like, well, it's game over,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2036.0,2040.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: and that was because of all the kids misbehaving outside. Was let's talk about that, but really quick, in my research I've done, I've also said something with the dance hall permit from the City of Tucson. Did that actually play into this?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2041.0,2053.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, there's a bunch of sagas here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2054.0,2057.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Let's go through them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2058.0,2058.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: So, here's how that came out. The city created an ordinance that to try to deal with bars in different neighborhoods of how to, how to control them, and so they came up with this no dance hall permit, and and so at the DPC time there was some kid doing graffiti across the street and a cop saw the kid and chased after the kid, his hat blew off and someone stole it. And he hurt his leg and the chase running after the kid and so he was on a vendetta to try to go after the guy that was in charge of this business that brought all these crazy kids and so he found the no dance hall permit law to go after me, and he arrested me, and took me in handcuffs to jail, and but because of the connections that I had had established with the city council, they got me out of it, but it became a big factor for us, and we also got attacked by some other club, I don't know who it was, that called the state that we were renting from, and they terminated our lease, and that's when they started with this \"we're not allowed to dance, thing, and then just a bunch of craziness. The there's always been a struggle in the in the movement of what we've been doing. It's never been all flowing perfectly, and even though that's a spiritual notion of perfect place of perfect time, there's also the notion that I learned from the Futurist manifesto. The futurists are the Italian futurists. They wrote manifestos 1909 1910 There were these wild, crazy Italian guys, and yeah, I learned a lot from them when I was in Philly of their manifestos, and yeah, so the whole thing was about struggle, and there's great poetry and struggle, and no works of art can be created without the part of struggle, and so that notion of embracing your struggle that came from the Futurist manifesto that helped to inspire me to keep going through all this, all these sagas.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2059.0,2255.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So, speaking of the saga, so that dance hall permit struggle, along with kids generally just misbehaving, right, doing drugs, harassing the neighborhood, and the neighborhood association got on your case.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2256.0,2268.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, so what happened was the neighborhood association got me to go to City Hall in front of all the city council people, and they basically crucified me, saying that I was destroying their neighborhood, and which there was some truth to that, because of their kids were out of control, and I tried my best to control them, and I was one walking around the parking lot, and anyone can attest to that, being a junior cop, trying to keep everybody in line, and it just became so.. how that played out was there was a whole gutter scene that happened with these kids that were living on the streets in the 90s. It was a whole scene that happened, and it turned out that our building, the DPC, was one of the biggest punk venues in the country at that time, independent ones, and so all these kids started coming here from all over the country and they didn't give a fuck about the community like the local kids did and so they would go around like messing with the neighborhood and eventually the neighborhood people like couldn't handle it, and that's when it just became unfunctional.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2269.0,2365.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So, do you feel like the local punks were respectful of what you were doing and trying to be respectful of the venue and not do this kind of stuff?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2366.0,2373.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, I mean, the local guys were great, but at the same time they were very territorial too. We would have like guys from Phoenix come down here, and they like them, and then there was always stuff with Phoenix. Well, I've","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2374.0,2392.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: heard Legend of the Skinheads coming down and being, yeah, right,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2393.0,2396.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah, they're local. Kids were very protective, rightfully so, of their community, and these.. yeah, there was a skinhead movement going on. There was all sorts of different things happening at the time, and just trying to juggle all that stuff was.. yeah, it was really, really difficult. A lot of people lot of people didn't really know all the stuff that I had to go through to keep everything going, and then a lot of people were super pissed when I ended it all, and then, like, I abandoned them, but I, my back was against the wall, and I, yeah, I mean, I was getting harassed by cops, like I walked down the street, and I get a cop, or like coming after me, I had all sorts of stuff was happening at the time, and yeah, but the music never died, and the spirit of music doesn't never died. It just transformed into different eras. I, I didn't sign on in blood to be only one kind of style of music in life. It's a a big thing that happened for me, and my transformation is going to Burning Man and getting involved in learning and the DJ scene, and Philly, and then in Tucson, we were totally against the DJ scene, and that was not our world, and we couldn't understand it, or one nothing to do with it, and but after going to Burning Man many times, I, I learned the ritual of the dance and see how powerful it is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2397.0,2522.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Yeah, it seems like you know, looking at those old toxic tater tots, which had the lineup that you had on the monthly monthly schedule. It seemed very eclectic, and I spoke with somebody, Van Bolet, and he talked about how he would help put on rave shows, raves at the DBC, so it seemed like there was an eclecticism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2523.0,2543.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, there was that element, but at that time we didn't really like the dance scene, we were doing that. That's how we got in trouble. As one of the clubs, we had a famous DJ, a local DJ, and they didn't like him that he was coming over and working with us, and yeah, I had to pay a lot of bills, and I had to make the money, and I was finding ways to do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2544.0,2570.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Were you working as a full-time teacher at this time too?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2571.0,2573.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, well, I was part time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2574.0,2575.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Part time, so you would go teach during the day and do promotion talk shows, yeah. So, were you just like going nonstop, exhausted?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2576.0,2584.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Well, it wasn't that long that I was teaching, it was after school thing, but it was two different realms, and yeah, so as far as the eclectic nature of the booking that I did, and my musical influences, that's a big part of how all this happened too, and that all comes from Philly, and my musical upbringing was based on college radio, and I grew up listening to college radio, where there was a bunch of experimental music, whale sounds, and experimental European music, and all sorts of avant-garde experimental stuff, I came up listening to that stuff, and, and that always was there. And then I got one of the, my close friends, and the experimental high school that I got into was the son of the first trombone player from Count Basie's orchestra, and I used to go with him and hang out backstage with these elder, very successful black jazz musicians, and that's when I first saw that I, I could get into that world, and so that all that was my roots and my where I come from,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2585.0,2691.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: and you felt like that could carry over to to the DPC underground. Well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2692.0,2696.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: that that just made me. My booking of I would have experimental stuff, noise acts from Japan, or world music acts, or you know, something that was not in the, in the realm of, in the early punk days, it was straight up guitar, bass, and drums, any deviation from that, it was like looked down upon when TSOL first had keyboards. Everybody was like, 'What the fuck? I mean, keyboards, that's like you can't have keyboards. And then when Malignus Youth started doing Gregorian chants, and that was spoke my language. Punk rock was just too basic. I came from a jazz fusion world, that's what I was listening to all through the 70s, and then got bored with that, and then went into the better old wildness of Primal Punk Rock.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2697.0,2763.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: We jumped ahead a little bit, and I hope when we can go back, and I want to talk about the establishment of Dodik. I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. So, that's when you got that warehouse, and it started off kind of as like an art studio, and then you started doing shows. There is that correct?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2764.0,2780.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, so that that that building I got unbelievably cheap, it was $300 a month, and that lasted for 13 years, $300 a month for a whole warehouse and and at first it was there, was no power, there was no water, there was nothing. We had to make everything to get it functional, and and then it just was only natural that you know the music would come, and the first act that we had was this wild band called Sink Manhattan, and they brought - they did industrialized music, where they were using grinders and making sparks fly, and banging on metal, and it was super intense, which paved the way years later for the crash worship. All who remember that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2781.0,2851.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: yeah, a lot of people have talked about crafts person. So, with Dodik, what was the meaning behind that name? I'm curious about that,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2852.0,2860.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: so the it was Dodik intonation, it was the that was to on autumn where Dodik was wild, and so the the idea was the internal nation of the wild, that's who we were, but the first name was Hell Rad Club, and I didn't actually like that name. There's a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2861.0,2887.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: skateboard competition zones,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2888.0,2889.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: and then it was just the Hell Rad, it didn't fit into my spiritual nature, and yeah, all the names come out of that, of being connected in the earth-based cosmic cultural reality.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2890.0,2909.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So, along with those experimental shows, you had more conventional punk bands play there as well. Well, yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2910.0,2916.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: that was the main thing. And you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2917.0,2918.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: guys had, did you have artworks displayed, yeah, yeah, and so that was never an issue of like having these Wiley shows, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2919.0,2925.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: well, we had big panels, and they were wooden panels that we would get people to paint on, and right now, actually, at Solar Culture, is we've gone back to that notion, we have one wall with big wood panels on it, still doing it. Yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2926.0,2949.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: so Bruce, you get, you convince Bruce to move out here, and you guys start working together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2950.0,2957.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Well, Bruce had a history out here, he was here already. He went to high school here before he joined the Navy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2958.0,2965.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: What compelled you guys to move out of DoDayek and establish the DPC,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2966.0,2971.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: getting shut down and arrested, and all sorts of.. so one of the first shows, I don't know who did it. One of the first punk rock shows that we had there. I don't know who did this act of, but someone threw a rock at a cop car.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2972.0,2992.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: This is a doe die,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2993.0,2993.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: yeah. 31 East Tool, and land. On above the guy's head and put a big dent in the roof of his car, and the next thing I knew, I was standing in the middle of the street, surrounded by cops, surrounded by cop cars with their lights all on me, and I was telling him, \"Well, I'm a sculptor, I can fix the dent, and I'm really sorry, I don't know who did it. Yeah, and I quickly learned that I am liable for anything that happens with all these people that come. I knew that from Philly, but out here I got more harsh lessons in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=2994.0,3040.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: it, you had those kind of troubles at the Dyke. I thought that was mainly a DPC thing, so that's kind of interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3041.0,3045.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Oh no, it was all the way from the beginning.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3046.0,3049.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: So we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3050.0,3050.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: always had issues. It was not that, was that went hand in hand with the whole thing. There was the whole time, but because of the fact that I taught kids, and because of the fact that I was a serious level artist, I, I was able to talk with politicians, and I was able, I wasn't some one that they, you know, I could. That's how I made it work. The only way to make it work, I had to work with politicians, because otherwise we would have got shut down. The police were on our ass all the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3051.0,3091.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Yeah, yeah. And you didn't have a big, crazy mohawk, so that probably didn't scare me. Yeah, I was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3092.0,3096.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: teaching kids and working for the school district, and, and I was a serious person, and that they couldn't just, you know, push me out, they, they had to treat me with respect in a certain way,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3097.0,3114.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: so you move over, you and Bruce, who else is involved in establishing the DPC,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3115.0,3121.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: there was a bunch of people at that time, but the main","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3122.0,3126.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: players, if you can remember","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3127.0,3127.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: well, Anita was there, and her partner, Dave Kay, and they helped their there was Mark Rosenberg, he was there helping this guy, Jerry was helping, and then there was one of my partners, Cinda was there, there was, there was all different people at the time, the DPC. The first year we borrowed money from this guy, Steve Luck Scheids, and he helped us to get the PA equipment. We were borrowing equipment the first year all the bands did benefits to help pay for the equipment to help pay to sustain the whole thing, and yeah, it's just it was a big struggle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3128.0,3195.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Did it become self-sustainable at a certain point?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3196.0,3198.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, that's the part of the stress, you know, a lot of people are like, \"Oh, I want to start a venue, and I want to start it, you know, that you don't understand all the stress that's involved, and keeping everything together, and especially with all the wildness of punk rock.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3199.0,3217.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Did you have anybody you can commiserate with throughout the country, were doing similar punk clubs, or did you feel like you were just kind of out in the wild doing your own thing?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3218.0,3227.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Well, back then there was no internet, so it wasn't so easy to communicate, but you know, we heard through bands that were touring stuff, so the difference from then into now, the way it would be, I would get a call from a booking agent or a band and giving me a certain date, and I'm like, okay, I don't know who they are, I don't know anything, and then I would call Bill at Toxic Ranch, and Bill, do you know who these guys are? Do they sell any records? You know, what are they good? Or, you know, there's no way to find out anything back then. And compared to once the internet happened, I could see them and hear them and see how many people like them, and it was a whole different world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3228.0,3283.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: Did that ever bite you in the ass? Booking a band blindly, and then","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3284.0,3289.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: I mean, back then they would send CDs, so you would get to hear them, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3290.0,3296.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: did you have policies about the types of band? You wouldn't book,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3297.0,3300.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: well, I did turn down someone that everybody was pissed at me for, and where I can't remember his name now, that guy that shouldn't piss all over GD Allen, GG Allen, yeah,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3301.0,3319.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: people were pissed. You wouldn't put GTL. I was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3320.0,3321.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: like, you didn't have them at your house. I'm not having them do that shit in our building. I mean, we had crash worship that destroyed our buildings every time they would come. I mean, full on food fights come that one time we had two inches of slime over everything from a food fight that they helped create.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3322.0,3350.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: I want to talk about how you decided on that particular building and how you built it out, because it seemed like there's a big effort in making it into a venue itself, but how did you decide on that specific building?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3351.0,3364.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Well, when we got in trouble at 31 East Tool, and that was never legal, couldn't get that legal, and for assembly use, and so it started looking for other buildings, and we found that one that was also owned by ADOT, that's how we got all the buildings so cheap, and then from there we got the DPC Cafe building, which became Luna Loco Cafe, where Bruce and Nadia were running, but it was all through a dot, Arizona Department of Transportation. We got these buildings really cheap,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3365.0,3415.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: and they had no issue with you turning it into, like, a punk rock.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3416.0,3419.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: That was, yeah, they did, and that was that was the part that was really wild, because we were in this weird gray area where Tucson was like, we're not liable, because it's owned by the state, and the state was like we're not liable, it's in the city jurisdiction, and they would like try to cast off liability onto the other jurisdiction, and and so we sort of were able to slip through as long as I mean the whole thing was having someone being responsible that was someone that they could relate to, you know. I was the person that they were, you know, looking at of being responsible, you know. This guy teaches kids, he works in the school district, you know. And so, yeah, and on their way, I would talk to them. It was something that they, they didn't know how to, they didn't really know what to do with me, but they didn't. The thing that they did in support was just let me be, you know. They never gave me money, they never really only got me out of the jail thing that time, but other than that, they would let me be. And then the difference between what happened here and what happened in San Francisco, and the ghost ship, the warehouse that caught on fire, and all these people had burned was here. I was taught by building officials and fire department how to make it safe. They worked with me. I couldn't hide from them, and that was really important. How I was willing to do anything that it took to make them happy with what we were doing, and that's been the case all along. That's why I'm still 38 years later. I now, I, it's not, it's now it's privately owned, and I have to keep the owner happy, but yeah. so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3420.0,3562.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1: it seemed like when you, you all established the PPC, certain people had certain responsibilities. Bruce would be the sound guy, Anita was kind of doing the door and kind of general things. You were booking and de facto security guard, right? Did that happen naturally, or did you guys just decide this is how it's going to be?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3563.0,3583.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2: Yeah, it was just organically the way it was. I mean, I was always the one that did the booking, and that I look back on some of those calendars and I'm like, oh my god, like 18 should. It was in a month, it's insane. 15 shows in a month, like later I was doing six to 10 shows a month, and that was just insane. And then I don't know how the hell, yeah, I now that I'm about, I'm turning 70, I'm like, I look back and I'm like, my goodness, what the hell was I thinking back then?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=3584.0,59.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: Those months were packed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=60.0,59.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: Yeah, it was wild.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=60.0,59.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: So, you, you talked about how you had a relationship with Bill Satzenberg from Toxic Ranch. Any other relationships with local punk bands, or punk, like I don't know what you would call them, promoters, or anything like that that you established to help you along your way to keep the DPC afloat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=60.0,59.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: No other promoters, I wasn't interested in that, because it was always my name at the end of the day. I rarely had any other promoters, very rare, but we did have some, but mostly none, until I stopped being a promoter when I turned 60, and then I now, then I let other promoters, and now I rent out the building, but before that I was very protective, and I wouldn't just let anyone come in there, and yeah, wasn't easy. It","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=60.0,60.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: seemed like, you know, looking back on those old calendars, you made a conscious effort to promote local bands and put local bands on bills with bigger touring bands. Did you have any, what kind of relationship did you establish with any particular bands or anything, anything you want to talk about with that, like, who do you had a close working relationship with, local band-wise? You mentioned Malinda's youth,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=61.0,60.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: yeah, they were, they were at that time, they were the biggest local act that we worked with, yeah, American Death Trip, and those guys, and you know, Opinion Zero, and yeah, that we had like relationships with all of the UPS guys, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=61.0,61.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: what about touring bands? It seems like you know Ian McKay seems to be sort of a continuing thread throughout your, your time at the DPC, into Diak, and even after that, any other relationships you established like that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=62.0,61.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: Well, I mean, the bad brains we were always connected to, and then there was it's just an ongoing, like, sea of people, like one after another. There was always in the booking world, you're always like three to six months in the future, you know, you're always like, you know, that I, yeah, I'm sure there were, I yeah, my memory of all of it is fading, but the sad thing is, I remember a lot of trauma stuff. Yeah, more than then you know people. Do you remember that show? And I'm like, I don't. I was outside a lot of the time, so making sure that it was okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=62.0,62.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: We touched on briefly sort of the sense of community in place that you were establishing or trying to establish with the DPC, do you feel that you were successful in creating a community there of people to express themselves or just be themselves naturally?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=63.0,62.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: I mean, I, that would be hard for me to say, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=63.0,63.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: just based on what you're perceiving, as far as people interacting with the music or with each other.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=64.0,63.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: I mean, I hope that I did. I mean, they have, I hung out at the DPC group page, and so they're still talking about that stuff 30 years later, or 40 years in Philly, but yeah, I mean, I hoped it was very inspiring for people, because I gave up my whole life, basically. I didn't have kids, and I didn't get a house of my own. I always lived at the warehouse, for I lived at the warehouse for 30 years. It was before I, I came out here to the West Side, and yeah, I mean, my whole life was oriented towards the show business and the art world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=64.0,63.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: Well, I. Speak as only one person, but I discovered the DPC when I was 14. The last six months, I think, of its existence, and it completely changed my worldview. I went to a place where I saw people who could freely express themselves. I got bombarded with brand new ideas I had never would have never been exposed to growing up on the East Side of Tucson. So I'm proof of at least one person, and I know there's hundreds, if not 1000s more. Yeah, there's a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=64.0,64.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: lot. Yeah, it's, it's, yeah, it's up for all these guys to say what they did, but yeah, I mean, I, I, it was not always easy, rarely easy for me to deal with all of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=65.0,64.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: What do you feel compelled you to do this? I mean, you could have just been a full-time art teacher, or just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=65.0,64.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: what compelled me? The I don't do it anymore. Journeys altered journeys doing mushrooms or acid taps me into the spirit realm, and the spirit realm, like when I go out to nature and I make an offering and hope for a message, the message that keeps coming is make ecstatic energy available to the people, and the way I've done that is through music and art and all the ideas came from when you're in an altered realm, you have the powers to figure out how to heal the world, and so it all came from all that, reading spiritual books and being in service is the manifestation of the your responsibility of being spiritually aligned and connected, and so it's always been that way, that that's the path that I walk on, not for myself but for what I can be in service to help humanity, and the way I translated that is through music and art, and the weird, the weird thing is now I'm burnt out on all of it, and now that I lived in that building, and most of my life, and how many band shows, and what I had to live through, and now I like peace and quiet and nature. My connection to the desert is what sustains me now, and I but I will, and I still have oriented my life to preserving that building for whoever wants to bring their culture forward, because I felt like I got to do that in my life. I brought the culture forward that I wanted to bring for so many years, and then I'm done, and I do it in my own way now. I, I got into through the guy that took our building, I got into the real estate world, and now I rent art studios out, and we have a lot of people having spaces because we provide low budget spaces for people that are startups that want to do their art studio thing or healing arts or something in the art related field.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=65.0,68.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: Well, I certainly thank you for not only your time then, but your time now. If there's anything else you want to add to this, this is a wonderful conversation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=69.0,68.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 2  1:0: I think you guys got it all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=69.0,68.999"},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SPEAKER 1  1:0: Thank you, Steve.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418#t=69.0,71.0"}]},{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://arizona.aviaryplatform.com/collections/3707/collection_resources/170509/file/309418/transcript/95121/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/095/121/original/azu_ms858-009_a_transcript.vtt?1783370464","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/095/121/original/azu_ms858-009_a_transcript.vtt?1783370464"}]}]}]}